SavedByGrace

Too late. He's already planning your demise.

laughs like Joker Likewise

begins to plot the demise of your plot of Nicolas's demise

not fair! chance is always fair! flips coin

xD Unless you have heads on both sides. >_>

Oh, okay. Thanks. I don't like my picture taken either…so I understand (though I didn't cry about it…) :)

(In refernce to Your reply to dani) I'm proud of you, that took a great deal of courage on your part to do what you did (which I am not going to spell out on this public forum). Sam is proud of you also. Though he might be a little jealous

He is? And, jealous of what?

He's jealous that Nicolae saw Dani, and he didn't!

Come on… you guys need to cut this out.. : /

Whatever you say, thy wish is my command! (though whatever that means, I do not know) pulls out knife and extracts 'it'

@Carissa–Yes, I do not tend to like getting my picture taken. I can tolerate it, but if I can get out of it, I will. ;D

why are you cutting 'it' out? She asked for 'this' to be cut out.

so sorry! cuts 'this' out

I know… delayed reaction, but… LOL!!! :D

What makes deception morally acceptable as compared to lying?

Rahab and the spies? I hope you will correct me if you think me wrong. Rahab lied: that was wrong. Rahab hid the men: that was right. Heb. 11:31 she was saved for her faith in receiving the spies with peace.
Pharaoh and the midwives? Exodus 1:17 They feared God.
Can God not handle it, if he wants you to succeed in the task, will he not give you an offical who does not have good english. If He wants you to be sent back or detained, will he not provide accordingly? The righteous and the unrighteous are directed by his hand. :)

This is a theological topic which has been much debated over the years. I have to carefully say, though, that I am of the opinion that deceiving a person who intends to harm you or force you to do evil is not wrong. I've never seen in Scripture that lying is always wrong; but let me quickly clarify. The ninth commandment says, "You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor." In the NT, we are commanded, "Do not lie to each other [fellow believers]." Deception for dishonest gain, of course, is always condemned by God, but is it wrong to deceive an unbeliever who is trying to harm you, make you do evil, or keep you from doing good? I personally do not think so.

Can God not handle it, if he wants you to succeed in the task, will he not give you an offical who does not have good english. If He wants you to be sent back or detained, will he not provide accordingly? The righteous and the unrighteous are directed by his hand. :)

I fully agree! But perhaps God has chosen to "provide accordingly" through the method Leah is planning on using? :)

Nicolas: Just a friendly reminder that you might want to remove the name of the country. :-)

Whoops!! Will do that immediately. :O

Just wanted to say this: I am not upset at either of you, neither do I think you are nessasarily doing something wrong. It just bugs me when someone says God will bless them for lying. I think generally God blesses people despite their lying,

Hmm… perhaps you are correct. But since I am not yet personally convinced of this, my conscience has not bothered me about it as of yet. If someone can provide me with biblical truth in opposition to my present view, I promise I will change that view immediately.

(Sorry I didn't see this until just now. :})

I'm glad your conscience is clear on this subject; if it weren't, I certainly wouldn't encourage it. :) And of course, I'm glad you're certain you wouldn't write anything that would make it look like you were denying Jesus; I think it would possibly be a sin if you were to do that, though I'm not certain. And don't worry about starting a small debate; as you may have been able to tell, I'm usually rather fond of them anyway. ;)

"But be on your guard. For they will deliver you over to councils, and you will be beaten in synagogues, and you will stand before governors and kings for my sake, to bear witness before them. And the gospel must first be proclaimed to all nations.
And when they bring you to trial and deliver you over, do not be anxious beforehand what you are to say, but say whatever is given you in that hour, for it is not you who speak, but the Holy Spirit. " – Mark 13:9-11

I agree with those verses; but I don't see how they necessarily say that it is wrong to deceive wicked authorities to get out of unjust punishment.

Is it right to deceive?

It says not be anxious, but in the KJV it says not to think beforehand what you should say (I think)

See my post on the previous page; it explains my position.

@Bethany–I think it means that it is not necessary to think beforehand of what to say; not that it is wrong to do it. And I don't understand the first part of your sentence; could you explain?

What do you think about obeying those in authority over you? I am not sure I agree with this position that I am proposing, but taking the "SolaScriptura" approach which everyone loves, this seems like the only reasonable choice. If you do not believe you have to obey those who order you to do something wrong, where do you see this.

Obviously it was wrong for Abraham to lie about his wife to the king. That was, I think, not in God's will, not because they were caught, but because they were lying to the king. "And Abraham said, 'Surely the fear of God is not in this place; and they will slay me for my wife's sake'" His lying almost caused the king of Gerar to sin, and be killed by God.

One thing I have always wondered was why God would bless the patriarchs so much when they where such notorious liers! (Sorry, I’m going way off the topic….)

But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them. And the gospel must first be published among all nations. But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.

In KJV for you.

Leah - you can share the passage with you parents than, and let them see it. Because, I see it saying that we should premeditate on what to say.

This is just some things to think about :)

Nicolas - sorry, I was just repeating that ESV says not to meditate on it, while KJV says not to think of what to say.

Bethany meant to say "not premeditate".

(I'm going to briefly interrupt this conversation to post this, my character for the RPG, which was requested on Brickmaster 2.0…)

Turner the Adventurer

Age: 21

Clothing: Black all around; tunic, trousers, and boots. Also wears a black cape and hood, which usually hides his face from view. Generally refuses to use armor at any time.

Appearance: Low-cut brown hair and short brown beard. 6'2, and fairly muscular build.

Weapons: Ancient-looking broadsword. Is also excellent with any kind of bow, and says he can handle a mace and a battle axe, but his sword is always his weapon of choice.

Description: Despite his secretive look and ways, those who manage to become his friends will find that he will open up to those he thinks he can trust. He can generally control his temper, but he has been known to fly into fits of rage when greatly irritated. Is especially ferocious in battle; but can be extremely tender if the need arises. Virtually nothing is known by anyone about his family history, and the history of even his recent past is shrouded in mystery. Rumor has it that he was once a noble in a far-off country, but recently came to seek his fortune in Alavaria.

{Had to delete much of what I said in the past conversation; hopefully you can understand why. ;)}

"And when they had brought them, they set them before the council. And the high priest asked them, saying, 'Did we not strictly command you not to teach in this name? And look, you have filled Jerusalem with your doctrine, and intend to bring this Man’s blood on us!' But Peter and the other apostles answered and said: *'We ought to obey God rather than men.'*" -- Acts 5:27-29

nods Instead of saying, "We won't never talk about Jesus again."

Thanks for coming on and defending me, Nicolas!

When was that? I wasn't trying to attack you….

I know you weren't trying to attack me. But what you said really hurt and SBG and Sam were helping me.

I am very sorry! Please forgive me! :( -Sarah

It's okay. Yes, I do forgive you. I'm really sorry that I have been annoying you. :-(

Okay, yesterday night i was in a big hurry and had to use my brother account… :S I'm still very, very sorry!

I wanted to make sure you saw this. About it for some reason letting you stay on memverse..I would say either don't use it or ask your dad about it. And ask yourself…if my parents were watching would they want me to use it? Or, would God want me to use it?

Thank you, Carissa. :)

Sure :)

Come home, come home, oh Nicolae come ho-o-ome~

So Nicolas…a couple things…

1. I don't have any more memorized in Hebrews (and since I'm going to be busy for the rest of the day I won't be able to have any more memorized today).

2. I analyzed my writing and I got Dan Brown and H.P.Lovecraft. Dan Brown is an american author well known for his thriller fiction and H.P.Lovecraft wrote Horror fiction. =P I used my key story and my "paper" about eternity.

Just thought I'd tell you on here since I won't be on tonight. :)

So Nicolas...a couple things... 1. I don't have any more memorized in Hebrews (and since I'm going to be busy for the rest of the day I won't be able to have any more memorized today). 2. I analyzed my writing and I got Dan Brown and H.P.Lovecraft. Dan Brown is an american author well known for his thriller fiction and H.P.Lovecraft wrote Horror fiction. =P I used my key story and my "paper" about eternity. Just thought I'd tell you on here since I won't be on tonight. :)

1. Mwahaha, then I am ahead of you! xP

2. Okay, cool. I analyzed my digital journal on there too, and apparently it was in the style of some random Canadian blogger whose name I forget… :P

1. Where are you?

2. Mmkay

1. Where are you?

I finished chapter 2, and am planning on moving on to chapter 3 tonight. :)

JSYK, my aunt, uncle and grandpa are coming here today and so I won't be memorizing anything in Hebrews while they're here. Keep up the great work! =)